The No Simple Road Podcast Transcript Repository

00:04 - Dan (Guest)

that's the story right. You try to say you're all, everybody's always muted. It's like a whole thing what's up, man?

00:09 - Aaron (Host)

how's it going dan?

00:10 - Dan (Guest)

oh, it's great. How are you guys?

00:12 - Aaron (Host)

awesome, so good, awesome.

00:13 - Dan (Guest)

I'm aaron aaron, nice to meet you, nice to meet you too my name is mel dan hey mel, what's up?

00:20 - Apple (Host)

and then I'm apple apple yes how are you guys?

00:24 - Dan (Guest)

you having a good night?

00:25 - Mel (Host)

oh yeah, yeah, we were chilling, we were watching game of thrones hanging out with our son uh tea and coffee time.

00:32 - Dan (Guest)

Yeah, chilling, all right, nice how about you man, I got some family in town so I was just hanging with my two twin nine-year-old nieces, oh, and we're like doing the whole like mini golf and a little, uh, a little ice cream, you know.

00:48 - Mel (Host)

So that whole thing, so it's pretty awesome actually oh yeah, dude, family time is so amazing when, especially like, if you haven't had it in a while, like you haven't seen each other, it's it feels like I mean, it's just a heart and twin twins are magical.

01:03 - Dan (Guest)

Yeah, they are, yeah, like yeah, there's definitely that it's super special. The wife and I don't have any kids, we just have three crazy dogs. Those are kids. I think three crazy dogs equals one kid.

01:18 - Mel (Host)

There's weird math there. What kind of dog?

01:20 - Apple (Host)

Because people will want to know there we go.

01:26 - Aaron (Host)

Andrew.

01:27 - Andrew (Guest)

What's up, y'all what's up man, hey, how's it going.

01:30 - Aaron (Host)

Five years brother.

01:32 - Andrew (Guest)

I know man Where'd it go.

01:34 - Aaron (Host)

Where does the?

01:34 - Andrew (Guest)

time go it got eaten up.

01:36 - Apple (Host)

A lot has happened in the world.

01:39 - Mel (Host)

Oh my gosh Faster and faster, yeah, wow. Dan, do you remember what you were doing five years ago? Uh touring I think touring okay yeah, off and on right okay, you were singing on.

01:53 - Andrew (Guest)

Uh, you were singing on my, my solo record is staying on andrew's solo record. That was super fun so I met these guys. Yeah, man right on um, all right.

02:03 - Aaron (Host)

So, dan, why don't you go first introduce yourself to the folks that are listening, so they know who you are?

02:08 - Dan (Guest)

yeah, so I'm dan lottie, the singer, uh, and rhythm guitar player and bass player, uh, for the band danger muffin thank you for joining us today.

02:20 - Aaron (Host)

Dan andrew, your turn, man I'm andrew hendricks.

02:24 - Andrew (Guest)

I play uh acoustic and electric bunch of different electric mandolins. Uh and danger muffin all right, thanks.

02:32 - Aaron (Host)

Thanks for hanging out with us tonight. You guys appreciate it thanks for having us yeah, so tell us all about danger muffin.

02:39 - Dan (Guest)

We want to know everything all right, so I can definitely do that I can just stop me because I'll keep going and I will never stop and uh, so somebody's got to like let me know. Okay, I've said enough. Um, so we started, uh, on folly beach in south carolina as a little beach town outside of charleston. I went to school in charleston and I started playing a lot of gigs. There was gigging five, six nights a week. It's a very vibrant bar scene, lots of live music, and I spent a little bit of time in New York City and came running as fast as I could back to Charleston and I met Mike Savilli, who's the lead guitar player. We started gigging together five, six nights a week and started writing some original songs, eventually picked up a drummer First original drummer. We put out an album called Bermuda. That was super fun to do.

03:42

The original drummer moved on in his own path. Stephen joined the band and that was about 2009. Okay, so since since about that time 2009, 2010 we've been touring, you know, 130 shows a year. Uh, nationally, we got connected with the great agency out of Nashville called New Frontier Touring Paul Lohr who was booking building the Avett Brothers at the time. Ok, so we got to get on to a lot of different events and festivals. We went back and forth to Seattle from Charleston, which I think is about as far as you can drive on the continental.

04:21

Yeah twice, twice, oh my gosh, um. So we hit it hard, you know, um, and we've done quite a few albums, um, I think we are. We just released our seventh album, uh, on friday, which we're super excited about congratulations thank you, thank you.

04:43

Uh, the band. I'll say this one more thing. The band started in this little bar we used to play every Sunday night on Folly Beach. It was called Surf Bar and it was kind of like this vibes, very like Bohemian, costa Rican sort of vibes, and it was like surf videos on the TVs in the background and then bluegrass music and like that was the vibe where we started. So we used to play every Sunday night and we'd always invite bands to come sit in, come hang out, like. So we sort of loved that, like cause we were creating this community, creating this scene.

05:18

You know which? Folly is a very special vibey place and that was the first time we met andrew. Okay, I remember we had a friend of mine was like you gotta hear this band yarn, like they're fantastic, you're gonna love it. And so they came in, played a set and we got to know all the, all those guys and had just a fantastic evening. I remember that night we closed the bar down and we all, when we realized we all knew who Dan Reeder was. Do you guys know who Dan Reeder is?

05:49 - Apple (Host)

No.

05:50 - Dan (Guest)

He's like this older kind of folk singer funny folk singer and we all, like, knew his songs, and so we're literally like singing his songs together at the top of our lungs and surf bar, and that's how the friendship was born.

06:04 - Apple (Host)

Yeah, wow, wow, okay so there's together at the top of our lungs and surf bar, and that's how the friendship was born.

06:06 - Aaron (Host)

Yeah, wow, wow, okay. So there's a lot there, but I have to know driving driving from one side of the country to the other twice in one summer. What did you drive in?

06:19 - Dan (Guest)

gotta know it was an old, you know, not super old, uh, but it was a dodge. Whatever van it was, I couldn't tell you the model at this point okay we call her vani watu, but it made it so, thank god. I think the transmission went out a couple years later in ohio, which was kind of crazy, but for the the most part we've had pretty good luck knock on wood with our touring vans.

06:48 - Aaron (Host)

Okay, because that's a blessing.

06:50 - Apple (Host)

Yeah, I know that can be a thing.

06:52 - Andrew (Guest)

I've heard many a story. Now we're all still alive, dan, we've done okay.

06:56 - Aaron (Host)

Yeah, that does make a difference, and you all still talk to each other, so that's cool too, because you travel well together. Yeah, andrew, how is uh how things changed since like doing your solo stuff and now doing this?

07:11 - Andrew (Guest)

well, I think I was, I think I can't quite remember, but when we were talking, I last, um, I was playing, I was like, I guess, in Danger Muffin and we were doing sort of like an acoustic national tour with doing an acoustic thing, but because it was with Yonder Mountain String Band, they didn't want to dance, you know, they didn't want the full experience of, like, the bass and the drums, and so we all love acoustic music.

07:44

It's a, it's really dear to our hearts, you know, but it's not, it's just just one facet of this band. But we did the acoustic tour with them. But I think we were all kind of itching, as satisfying as that was to like get back with some drums and and, uh, you know, plug in a little bit and uh, get a little bit more experimental. And so, um, we did that tour and then I had children and covid happened and I think, uh, I think we just made a. You know I can't speak for the band, but I think there was just like a kind of collective decision that we should shut the ship down during COVID, like not push the waters, not jeopardize people's health and safety, as financially hard as it was not to play, but we just kind of took a little break.

08:38

um, you know or at least that I sort of you know I felt like that's where my head was at that time and then that said, it was really exciting for us to get back together. What was the catalyst for you guys to jump back in? Well, I mean, I'd say it was. I just missed playing. Like, we have such a fun time playing together and I mean, didn't we all just miss music on such a profound level.

09:11 - Aaron (Host)

Dude, you were like teaching lessons online, right?

09:15 - Andrew (Guest)

Yeah, I was teaching, I was a college professor and doing a whole bunch of other things which I still do and I still it's really impactful and meaningful. But, um, you know, there's just nothing like jamming, and especially jamming with people who you have like a lot of musical trust and a lot of faith in and long, long-term friendships, like it's. You know, it's pretty magical, like both as a fan and as an artist, it's awesome. So we were obviously pretty chomping at the bit. To get back to it.

09:48 - Apple (Host)

You said something in there too that we were wondering. When we talked to you five years ago, it was like two weeks away from your daughter's due date, you were getting ready to become a father and you just said a minute ago had children, so you've had several children now.

10:08 - Andrew (Guest)

I do. We love it so much. We have a son. I have a son now, august, and yeah, it's even better now it's like, almost like, having three dogs.

10:19 - Aaron (Host)

That's the math right three dogs equal one kid that's right.

10:24 - Dan (Guest)

Yeah, I was listening back to the interview because I love to do that when we have. That's the math right. Three dogs equal one kid, that's right, yeah that's what we determined.

10:26 - Apple (Host)

I just I was listening back to the interview because I love to do that when we have somebody on again to listen back to it and going back in a time machine five years it was, and mel said it. I told her. I was like you told him too, you're like congratulations, because you're getting ready for the alb, your album, to come out, which we were calling your baby. And then you're ready to have a baby. She goes you're going to be addicted, you're going to want more babies of both kinds Congratulations.

10:52 - Mel (Host)

It's hard to do just one One kid is great. It's amazing, it's a blessing. Then you start to see they want to play with somebody. They need a buddy, even like a dog too. A dog needs a buddy, you know I get it for sure.

11:08 - Dan (Guest)

They need a pack.

11:09 - Aaron (Host)

Yeah, yeah um, so tell me a little bit about the, the new album danger muffin yeah, for sure I'll.

11:18 - Dan (Guest)

I'll jump in on an andrew, um, you know, I think andrew was right. We were just it itching to play and get back together. Honestly, you know, I think we all definitely felt the isolation right from the lockdown. The COVID experience was such a thing that we all went through in like our own ways, maybe in our own little you know I don't know what I'm saying we're trying to say, but just in our own little um, you know, uh, I don't know what I'm saying we're trying to say, but just in our, in our own worlds, right? So, to reconnect, you know, the music for for me personally in music has always like checked so many social boxes. It's kind of like a weird thing, like I almost don't know who I am unless I'm like playing music socially, which is maybe another conversation.

12:05

But, um, it made so much sense to get back together and, uh, and start reconnecting with some of the community that danger muffin has been building for, you know, all all these years. Um, and so we made like a little Facebook post about it, like we're back and people were super excited and we're like messaging with everyone. So this immediate momentum, you know, right, and um, we started writing. We were, we had like a writing session in, uh, in a little mountain town outside of ashville, a little place called rosman, which is closer to brevard, which is a great music town.

12:44

Um, a lot of like the string dusters guys are there and like jeff sipe lives there, so it's like a whole, it's whole own vibe, it's a thing yeah, and then this we went to this little cabin way up in the in the hills on like a little mountaintop and spent like a week there and just we all brought our ideas together and just recorded everything.

13:03

I think we ended up with like eight or nine hours of recordings and then we combed through them and found like the time stamps and the grooves that we loved and just kind of built from there, which eventually led to last summer we were in um, we wanted to go to echo mountain here in Asheville, which is a premier recording studio in the southeast, has quite a history, quite a vibe, and so we've always wanted to do a record there because of all the amazing records we've heard from there, like again citing the Avett Brothers, like Emotionalism was done there, there's some my Morning Jacket, band of Horses, that kind of vibe. It all kind of came out of the studio. So we really wanted to be a part of that. So we recorded that last summer and we've just been working nonstop on the edits and just the whole process or basically like our own label. So we've just been doing everything on our own and it's been a labor of love.

14:07 - Aaron (Host)

Yeah, um, and now we're super happy to sit here with you, uh, after just finally releasing it after two and a half years you know, you brought something up in there about the facebook side of it and, like you know, announcing, hey, we're coming back and there's momentum, right, and I I think that, like from doing no simple road for seven years now, one of the things that, like I always think about is, like, if we took a break, would we have people listening when we came back? I, that's like a concern of mine. If we ever had to, like take a extended period of time off, were you worried about it? Were you worried like, oh shit, all the stuff that we had built up over time, is that going to be still there?

14:58 - Dan (Guest)

I really wasn't, because I I think it was you know, even my initial thought was I just wanted to play you know and whatever.

15:07

Whatever it was like. If it was just like simple bar, bar gigs, like that's, that would be fine to just getting the music out and just having it kind of flow through. The veins again was kind of. The goal were yeah, we were a little surprised that people were like super stoked. You know, this kind of also came in tandem with some decent. That like I I feel like maybe to answer your question too like if if you guys took a break, would people still be around? I I think yes, because I think the true music fans, uh, particularly in you know the, the true authenticry, whatever you want to call it, authentic music like they're they're they're fans for life.

15:49 - Mel (Host)

Yeah.

15:49 - Aaron (Host)

Yeah, that's very true, and they'll be there. You know what I?

15:52 - Dan (Guest)

mean and and I think it's a it's a beautiful thing that we've been experiencing with that.

15:57 - Aaron (Host)

So well, it goes back to what you were saying about like not knowing really what to do with yourself or who you are. Apart from it, it's the same for us on the fan side of it, man and and covid I've talked about this before like covid really shined a light on that for for me personally, I don't know about your guys's guys' experience, but, like when the live music thing was gone, I would like go to my closet and I have, like, all these concert t-shirts and like what, who is this? Now Everything that I am about is ended and now I, like my identity is so wrapped up in the thing and there's you know what I mean? I don't even know what to do.

16:48 - Mel (Host)

It was really hard, man, so I completely understand what you're talking about I wonder you were saying um about like that time and you know, kind of like trying to figure out who you were. How is it like from a fan's perspective because you're also a fan of music and a musician's perspective during that time Like what are those two different feelings? Like how did you like what were you emoting at that time? Because you were missing it from a listening perspective, but also from a playing perspective.

17:20 - Dan (Guest)

I mean, maybe I can't, maybe, Andrew, you want to chime in too, but I'll just say, for me the whole thing felt like a void, right. I mean it just it was like an absence of well. I think music and community are like hand in hand and they feed one another, right. So it creates all this inspiration to want to hear this band, Like we just played here in Asheville last weekend at that AVL Fest AVL Music Fest and it was, like you know, getting to see all these amazing bands, all like Blitz and Trapper and, like you know, Langhorne Slim and stuff, and it's just so inspirational. So I think it feeds that. And, you know, I think that it was just an absence of all those things you know for quite a while, and so it was like a dormant, a dormant creative emotion that wasn't being expressed or, you know, listening to other music or creating, yeah, so that was like an interesting time, Andrew. What about you? What was it like?

18:27 - Andrew (Guest)

Well, you know, I was living in Philly with my family and we were I was up to my neck in diapers, you know. So it was my experience was filtered in a different way than I would imagine. It would have been like two or three years before. So kind of like hunkering down with just my kids was, despite just the horrible things unfolding around me. I just tried to really focus personally on like how like lucky I was to have this like little my own little community that said I would, I would walk my daughter to all around philly and and it was like we, it was like people passing with with, uh, their baby carriages were like smiling at each other and just like reaching out energetically, yeah, energetically that connection.

19:30

Like I've never smiled at so many strangers, you know what I mean yeah, like like we're all just hanging there. We got this, you know, like look at this beautiful day we have, and you know, by the tall ships in Philly and like you know, and that you know, those moments became so apparent that like we're missing so much that we're kind of grasping for it, but but it was really hard.

19:55

I mean, it's hard on so so many, so so many levels and I think you know, living through it, I still think there's probably a lot of healing that needs to go on. Yeah, that experience, instead of just turning the page and like moving on from it quickly because, yeah, live music is back. I still think there's a lot of, like inner work that needs to be done from that experience. You know, because it was, it was, it was it was gnarly, it was traumatic.

20:22 - Apple (Host)

yeah, we, yeah it was. We were talking to somebody that was a doctor, so it was like everybody went through a trauma and you can't just tuck that away and be like oh, I'm fine, now Everything's back to normal.

20:32 - Andrew (Guest)

It's all back.

20:34 - Aaron (Host)

Let's go get our concert tickets yeah, and with one eye twitching.

20:37 - Mel (Host)

I think a lot of people wanted that to happen and we kind of did out like initially, out the gate. We're like, oh, we can like go to concerts again, let's do it. But then after a while, yeah, you, you know, the dust settles and you're like, oh, why am I shaking? Still, what is happening? And then people I think a lot of people didn't really want to talk about it once it was over.

21:00

It was like get that out of here, you know we were exhausted because that was all we were ever hearing and talking about and feeling about. And then now we're out of it, now we got to talk about it again, like enough, yeah, like enough's frigging enough. But but if you don't talk about things, they bubble up, they come up, they come out, they come through us somehow or another. And so you know, I, I, just I, I only ask, because this podcast, to me, is a lot more than just hearing about music. It's about hearing about lives and people who change lives for a living. And if your life is changed indirectly by something you didn't do, then your output is also in like changed. You know, and so I just you know, I'm just a curious person about emotions and people's like state of mind, because that, really, when we're all cheering and, you know, loving the music, it came from that place well, it came from somewhere.

22:01 - Aaron (Host)

Our our first experience back from all that that was the String, dusters and Green Sky.

22:07 - Mel (Host)

Yeah.

22:08 - Aaron (Host)

Here and it was weird.

22:11 - Mel (Host)

It was very strange, it was really weird to be with people again. It's almost like looking behind your shoulder. We didn't know how to act.

22:19 - Apple (Host)

We'd almost kind of forgotten how to dance and they stole everything. Everything was pods. There was five people or six people allowed to a pod and it was like roped off. They were, it was so, but it was music and it was, and everybody was kind of once we started talking everybody's awkward after all, that you didn't know quite how to act with each other and the music, and but then that that quickly started fading as they were playing.

22:46 - Aaron (Host)

I think, too, andrew, you hit on something kind of important, like those walks that you took, where you're, you know, appreciating the day, you know, look at this day that we have and and smiling at people walking by. I think that if we're going to carry anything out of that mess, that should be the stuff that we're carrying forward with us into now, right, like those lessons have to stick. That's, that's not, that's not a temporary feeling that that's available now, right, and so those are the things that we should be like moving forward with. But mel's right, and that it it happened and it's hard to like, even for me, it's hard to even like think through it at this point.

23:39

It was so much for all of us and, like you, we were really fortunate. We all live together, so we have our own little community here too. So, you know, when things got really strange, we hung out with each other and it kind of seemed normal here at home. But yeah, I know that since all of that, the landscape of the music industry has really, really changed. It's really a lot harder for you guys. Gas is more expensive, it's harder to be touring and on the road, all these festivals are collapsing. Have you guys felt the pinch of the post-covid thing going on?

24:30 - Dan (Guest)

I, I think that you know. Yeah, I mean, it's definitely changing. I think it was changing even before covid really happened. You know what I mean. I think you saw this like a lot of these older sort of venues like closing down in favor of, like, the breweries and the micro festivals, and so it's it. We're in this constant state of flux with it and, yes, obviously, kovitz and the ripples through the industry and I think it continues to be the case.

25:00

I think that our approach to returning to playing has been to not tour quite as much. So it's actually been not, as you know, like as much of a shock for us because of maybe our approach, which is really just a few shows a month is kind of where we're at, you know. Or, like Andrea mentioned, he's got the family at home. Mikey, the guitar player, has a five-year-old daughter as well, and we're all kind of balancing different things. So that's kind of been our approach and it's been nice because we can really gear up for the, for like special events and really there's no like we're able to kind of be closer to our families, which is super nice my three dogs, et cetera. So that's kind of been our approach. So for us it hasn't been as much of a shock Again. We're riding this wave of kind of you know, wanting to step away or just stepping away when we had to and then kind of coming back in the in. The vibe has been welcoming and it's been a nice pace for us so far.

26:15 - Mel (Host)

That's great to hear, yeah.

26:17 - Aaron (Host)

You're one of the first folks we've spoken to that have said that.

26:21 - Mel (Host)

Yeah, because I think a lot of people try to you know if you are first of all missing out on. You know, income for a long time and your passion. I don't know which one's worse right, if you need money or if your passion goes on equal yeah, if your passion goes unfulfilled.

26:35

So then you have a tendency to like come on, let's go full throttle, let's do this. So, yeah, people are going to notice because, like what Aaron was saying hotel rooms, gas or whatever. But we have talked to quite a few people that it said that touring has gotten a little bit more of a like in a smarter sense, like we're not just doing everything that we were offered, we're not just taking every gig, and maybe if we would have taken a gig, you know, maybe far away from us, we're going to do a few more that we wouldn't have done, so that it can be work out for us.

27:07 - Aaron (Host)

And so it just made it seem like you just had to kind of tighten things up a little bit, um, not just with the music, but with the business of music tour and smarter yeah, like they're saying not harder, smarter yeah, nobody thinks when, when they're 16, you know, and they see the guy playing guitar and they want to be a rock star and they start taking lessons or whatever, you're not thinking that like okay, when I start a band, I got to run a business too.

27:35 - Andrew (Guest)

It's just not no, of course no man how is?

27:40 - Aaron (Host)

how is it for you guys navigating that side of things?

27:45 - Andrew (Guest)

Well, like we're definitely building. I feel like with the momentum and kind of the energy that is happening with us, like when we get together on stage, even though it's not, you know, happening like it used to where it's going to be you know, 20 shows a month or whatever I feel like because of that we're attracting like a really good team of people that are wanting to help us. Like we have an amazing um tour manager named named paul, who's just fantastic, and I feel like the team is just going to grow bigger and bigger and sort of and they're all. Everyone sort of seems to be on the same page with that. So I'm kind of excited about this year you know about, like what's going to happen or in the next year, in terms of making our team slightly bigger, hopefully increasing.

28:36

I would love more West Coast shows, our little run in Colorado, I think it certainly. Personally, it got me pretty excited about all these beautiful cities and towns that I miss. Maybe we don't have to hit all of them in a row, you know, but I definitely, I definitely want to get back out there and bring this music to all these beautiful places. You know that I've been so lucky with a career as a touring musician to get to know like really well and all the people that I miss. So you know, hopefully we'll be making that happen, you know, like with a some bigger and like a new with our, with our sort of new crew, which is exciting what?

29:24 - Aaron (Host)

what was the? What was the thing that made you feel like that when you did the Colorado shows? I'm curious.

29:35 - Andrew (Guest)

It was seeing some old friends. You know that I just that used to like pick me up early from the hotel rooms and take me hiking. You know, like before the shows, and just you know, hearing these old stories just brought me back to how special and how lucky I am to be able to do this as a vocation and that to me, and then, of course, just seeing beautiful landscapes I could still skip some airport hangs. Personally, I didn't miss that. There's a whole lot of it. That's also you know. You guys hear all about it. However, um, there's just, there's just nothing like um being in some of these beautiful spaces and trying to create something beautiful that's inspired by these spaces around you. Like that's how I was feeling when we played um, these shows in colorado. How could you not be inspired to play your best when you see?

30:32

like lovely people and these beautiful landscape. I don't know, it just doesn't get better.

30:38 - Aaron (Host)

No, you know what it makes me think of like a. You know, they say set in setting for psychedelics. It's the same thing for playing music too, right?

30:46 - Andrew (Guest)

oh, for sure, I think if I, if, if I could just jump in because I think for me yeah, it's, it's the same thing for playing music too, right?

30:49 - Dan (Guest)

oh, for sure, I think, if I, if, if I could just jump in, because I think for me, yeah, it's, it's definitely that like it's what a blessing it has been to have been able to travel and like play a show at, like the base of mount shasta oh, you know yeah, you know what I mean just place some places that you go just, and I think, um, maybe for me personally, like I, I you know it's always like this you go through this like roller coaster of emotions leading up to your show and you're singing, you're thinking about all these things and I think you really like tune in with the total energy of a place. You know like the geographic, like the mountains and the phase of the moon, and and all like you feel, like I feel a lot of place. You know like the geographic, like the mountains and the phase of the moon, and and all like you feel, like I feel a lot of that, you know. And so to, yeah, to to.

31:35

It has been in quite a few years, since we've been to colorado in this recent run. You know, like some one of these shows in particular, like we're out in this, like in western colorado, this apple orchard, and like everybody, the vibe is just, it's just an immaculate vibe, right, and we finished the set and somebody's like, oh, did you see the full moon behind the stage?

31:56

and it's like, no, I didn't see it, but like I felt it, you know yeah so I think that that's the best, one of the best things about being able to travel and play music and connect with communities and connect in these like spaces that are honestly sacred. You know they are.

32:14 - Aaron (Host)

Yeah, it's funny that you I I never really thought about it like that. I mean, I sure, like playing red rocks, I I could see that that would be. You know what I mean. But, like what you're talking about, it even translates to the indoor spaces that you go to as well, like if it's if that crowd is ready to go and the you know it's full, and there's that it's beautiful and the sound is amazing. Yeah, like I never, I never really thought about it like that, and and you sometimes sorry to interrupt.

32:51 - Andrew (Guest)

Sometimes, like the crew, we have a place that uh, I think is going to be uh in asheville called salvage station, and I've only had the privilege of playing there like a few times.

33:01

But when people call me last minute to like sit in and jump in on a show, they're like I'll do it simply because, like the crew and the people, the team that like does all the grunt work to make that place such an amazing venue, make it so fun and easy to just kind of like that's cool, run in, jump in, you know, play a few tunes that you're like I'd go just to, just because their energy is is, uh, it's as cool as that place is a beautiful space, an inspiring venue physically.

33:34

But I actually like just love the love the people and everybody there is working their ass off and seems really happy and just seems really to love it, and it's like there's places like that, like in detroit, that I remember we're just like man, you know, like what a great these people are working so hard because they love music and they don't even get to be the ones on stage and they do this work so that we can come in, you know, exhausted, and play and and uh, sometimes those, those moments can be just as special as the, you know colorado mountain thing.

34:08 - Dan (Guest)

Right, totally, man, and it makes such a huge, such a huge difference. If you yeah, like you said, andrew like coming in like eight hours in the van and you just want to like connect, you know you want to walk in as a band and you want to like I'm in this place, maybe I've been before, maybe it's been a while, maybe I've never been here, but I want to like connect with the first person that we talk to, the, the people at the venue, like what's the vibe, how does it feel? And the people that you know are really like present with you and just giving you that like welcome feeling, that love, like it makes the band feel so great and then it makes the show, you know, that much better, full of love. Everybody's comfortable.

34:51 - Apple (Host)

Vibing, you know's a that's a really big deal. That's like here here in portland our, our, the few of the smaller venues are our favorite place to see because because of those reasons, the staff, the everything, the sound, the community that goes out to it and stuff like to get down, yeah, like you said it, dan, earlier, about the music and community.

35:08 - Mel (Host)

They're kind of like synonymous with each other. How could you know, like you're? These people are paying money. They're planning weeks in advance to come see this. Even the workers they're excited that they get to see this, these incredible musicians, and it just like creates an energy before even the music is played.

35:30 - Aaron (Host)

Think about when we went to um ophelia oh, I was thinking about that while andrew was talking about it, and uh, we did a live thing from there with frasco last year around this time and from the minute we got to the venue, everybody there was like what can we do to help? What do you guys need, you know? Do you guys want some food, totally stoked?

35:54 - Apple (Host)

They didn't know who we were. We're excited, totally stoked, to be doing their job.

35:58 - Aaron (Host)

Like we talked to a couple of people that were like I fucking love working here so much. It's the best job in the world, and it made I was freaking out and it made everything so much smoother and nicer and well, and think about the energy level.

36:15 - Mel (Host)

If somebody's coming to you guys with that high energy, like greeting you and like come on in, that's adding to your playing somehow, even if you are exhausted for eight hours, you know huge, it's huge, it's huge, yeah, because it is it's music, it's community, it's.

36:32 - Dan (Guest)

You know, we're all participating energetically in the experience and I think it can be the place. You know that we are the, the people. I think it's all one in the same, like we're, we're sharing, we're creating, we're cultivating this energy, this energetic experience, right, and it's uh, so it's all a big, a big synergistic, like you know, hang, or whatever yeah, yeah, and it feels good.

36:56 - Mel (Host)

Do you feel like?

36:59 - Aaron (Host)

that is, do you try and translate that experience to putting out an entire album? Is is or are you? Are you showcasing the songs or are you trying to get, uh, something across energetically with the body of work?

37:20 - Dan (Guest)

well, I think that, if you don't mind me continuing, andrew, I think that container of the synergy is within the band, you know. So I would point to, like the cabin session that we had to write the songs and the feelings and energies around. That is a high, high energy place, like kind of top of this mountain, amazing view, you know, and it was just us sharing the energies and experiences and bringing these different things offerings to the table. And so I think that's kind of where it can start with music, and then maybe the goal is to make it like as interpretable or like as it as it can be, and I think that is more of a byproduct of just being authentically in your, in your expression. You know if that's not too too deep.

38:14

No that I feel about it, you know. So I think inevitably people will connect, that are on that common vibe and then that'll translate, you know, into the shows.

38:24 - Aaron (Host)

I don't think that was too deep at all, the whole being authentically in your expression, I mean as a musician that's kind of the goal right To be in that place as often as possible, and it's not easy.

38:42 - Dan (Guest)

No, it's not, and I would go further and say it's the goal of life. I think you know, even though you know I don't know if I give me just one quick tangent I had this thought about, been thinking a lot about social media lately because it's been like Bring it on.

39:00

Dan, and I'm just like God, like what is this Like this is like, why do I have to do this? And then I'm like accepting it. Is this like this is like, why do I have to do this? And then I'm like accepting it and now I'm kind of like starting to enjoy it a little bit, which is super weird to say, but it made me think about like everybody's trying to express themselves and I think that like social media is giving us and then younger generations, an opportunity to express, whether it's music or whatever their art is. Like a photo is a is artistic, right, so the colors and the thoughts and the all the things so we're all trying to express all the time. So I think that's the goal of every minute is to be an authentic expression. Wow.

39:47 - Aaron (Host)

Yeah.

39:47 - Mel (Host)

What was the switch that helped you to start to enjoy something that can be so unenjoyable?

39:56 - Andrew (Guest)

Yeah.

39:57 - Aaron (Host)

Yeah man tell us With social media.

40:01 - Apple (Host)

Yeah with social media, because man, you're right, andrew.

40:05 - Dan (Guest)

Oh my God, you know I'll say this might be. I'll let Andrew say it as well, because I know he's been active doing the same. But what makes it enjoyable, Like realizing that it's a bridge to your community Wow, you can talk to somebody frigging like. I had a comment. We had a comment from somebody in Japan today. They're like I had to hit the translate button and it was like I'm loving the album.

40:34 - Aaron (Host)

Wow.

40:35 - Dan (Guest)

It's like this. That's amazing. I want to come to Japan. Wow, eat some sushi.

40:40 - Apple (Host)

Yeah, hang out with me yeah, and then that's not going to happen any other way except for with social media. Nowadays, that's how we well, aaron, runs our social media. It's so many connections have been made through it. Yeah, it's so hard. It's an amazing tool.

40:54 - Aaron (Host)

What about you, Andrew? Have you found a groove with it?

40:58 - Andrew (Guest)

No, the power's out on that for me. Yeah, I've tried, but what I do like about it, like I'm not, it's just like talking about what Dan said, about like your own personal truths or like expression, like I am just not going to probably ever be good at this, that kind of thing you know, and it's just not.

41:20

It's just not in me to do it Like, but what I can do with it is I love seeing other people's like happiness in terms of being like a more passive social media kind of like, kind of sort of like is I love seeing other people's like happiness in terms of being like a more passive social media, constantly kind of like. I love seeing my friends bands, like seeing their successes, like yeah, they played Red Rocks. I'm like you know what I mean like a little jealous but also just like so happy that they had those moments, and so that's where that's where I find my like personal redemption in it. I get it, but in terms of using you know and and also like I do, of course, like I'm human, I appreciate the like, some of the conversations and using it as a device to stay connected, but like I I you know it's, it's just not my favorite thing it's.

42:11

I'm with you, I'm it just, I'm just not, it's just probably never will be, and I might just be okay with it yeah, I'll never have a lot of I'll never have a lot of followers or whatever.

42:20 - Aaron (Host)

It's just I'm good, we, we have a buddy his name is cam and and he does like he's a comedian and he does bits On Instagram and he's gained Really pretty big following In the jam band world Doing like jaded fish, vet Videos and stuff like that and he's hilarious. And him and I had a conversation. He came to stay with us Not too long ago and we were talking about this very thing that we're talking about right now and he does a podcast too and he does these commercials for every episode and I was like dude, I can't do it. I can't get on Instagram and be like, hey, listen, but you have, you totally have.

43:09 - Mel (Host)

But I can't, even before anything that cam had to say, I think you guys. Aaron is not lying, but it's so much easier for him because he treats it like a job. His emotion is taken out of it and so, because the show needs it, he does it. But, I just had to throw that out there Cause he's saying all this but he's like so steady doing it.

43:34 - Aaron (Host)

And it looks like authentic and it is good at it. I fucking hate it and I feel so cringy and gross and I was like I can't, I can't keep doing it. And he was like listen, man, the people that listen to your show and I'm saying this to you guys too like the people that listen to your music, do it because they like you and what you do. You don't have to do anything, get on there and just be like, hey, what's up this week, you know, just be you. You don't have to put on a thing, just do you.

44:07 - Mel (Host)

But that's easy to say because I like you, me in, I look like a deer in headlights.

44:11 - Aaron (Host)

That's what I feel like, because we're wrapped up in this thing of we have to perform because the light is on.

44:18 - Apple (Host)

You need a costume.

44:19 - Mel (Host)

No, this is my thing. My thing is like who cares? That's like, and the overarching thing.

44:27 - Aaron (Host)

You better hope somebody cares no.

44:28 - Mel (Host)

I understand all the whys. I do, I truly do, but I'm like nobody freaking cares that I went to, you know, buy new roller skates, or I had a good coffee. No one cares. Okay, I might get some likes out of it, but like they care for eight seconds.

44:46 - Apple (Host)

I, and that's what it is for me.

44:48 - Mel (Host)

I feel I feel like taken from instead of given to, and that's my own head trip.

44:55 - Aaron (Host)

I've just started treating it like.

44:57 - Mel (Host)

I'm talking to you. Well, that's a different story.

45:01 - Aaron (Host)

This is the thing that's happening that you all need to know about, and ta-da.

45:06 - Mel (Host)

I'm proud of you, Dan. That's my whole point of this whole ta-da. I'm proud of you, dan. That's, that's my whole point of this whole thing. I'm really proud of you it's totally out.

45:13 - Dan (Guest)

It's out of necessity.

45:14 - Aaron (Host)

Necessity is the mother of invention, right yeah man but what a weird, thing, what a, what a great tangent you're like.

45:22 - Apple (Host)

I want to give me a moment for this tangent. Sometimes when you speak, I mean that has led to this whole conversation right here yeah, know what?

45:30 - Mel (Host)

because we talk about it, not the specific thing, but with other bands because it's literally expected. Now you cannot venues expected.

45:39 - Dan (Guest)

Yeah, bands have told they're like when you a lot, I want to reframe it because I think that we all know the dark sides of it. Like, yes, defeating the narcissism, and like what's happening, like is it maybe like destroying society? Like that, probably, maybe.

45:56

I think it's possible changing it, for sure it is changing, like the minds of the, the youth are. It's a, I mean obviously very different than when we were growing up. Oh yeah, but I mean mean I'm trying to like think about it in terms and just reposition it, see it through a different lens of just being something that you know, can I think everybody's, at the end of the day like we're creating every second, everything we say, every conversation or everything we do or create. So to give people an extension to do that, I think is is positive, you know, and and I think it's chaotic and there's some, it's some bullshit for sure, but it's good. It can be good for art, I mean it's it has been good for a lot of maybe this is super controversial, but a lot of people slam spotify, and I get it.

46:49

I get it. They're not paying what they should, but they're also opening up a global market for independent artists, and it's not just spotify but streaming, the whole the way things are going. So, yes, there's less money to be made per stream but, like I said, somebody in japan can discover you when you haven't toured japan, and I think that's I'm just trying to find.

47:14 - Mel (Host)

Yeah, right, so I'm bright siding it, you are it's totally bright side and you're not wrong with anything. You're saying it does need to be reframed and maybe if people think about it differently, they'll behave differently using it and it will feel different consuming it. You know.

47:31 - Apple (Host)

And it's and it's a connection, because we've talked about like that the Japan thing was a couple of weeks ago. You're like, well, we're doing really good in Germany or Poland or something again, because we started this like you did locally, locally, started to build a community locally, and then that gets bigger. And then you're like thinking, oh, now we're in some States and oh, now we're popular in the United States. But when you find out, the people on the other side of the globe are listening to you. I think that's a good thing for like global consciousness.

48:02

It's like our community our community goes around the entire globe. That is our community, you know it builds that. That's one of the other good things. I think of it, even though I really have a hard time with social media. I'm like you, andrew. I like to see, I'm on there to see what Aaron does for no Simple Road and everything, and to see all the bands that we meet, the ones I'm fans of, to see what, because that's how you see what's going on with everybody nowadays. In that sense, the tool, it's a great tool.

48:33

It is it's exactly that it's a tool and, like any tool, it depends on how you use the hammer you can build something, or you can smack somebody in the head with it and it's not fair to hate a tool.

48:46 - Mel (Host)

It's just a tool, it's just fair to hate a tool.

48:48 - Apple (Host)

It's just a tool.

48:49 - Mel (Host)

No, yeah, yeah, it's just a tool. It's just a tool, yeah.

48:51 - Aaron (Host)

Dan said something a second ago. I'm curious what you think Shit is changing. Right, the world around us is changing, everything is changing. I'm curious how you, as a dad, are navigating the current of the world right now and like how you approach that with being a father and your kids like, cause, our son is going to turn 22 this week, our daughter is 29. So I can't shield them from everything anymore. Like they're, the world is on 11 for them and I'm just got to see what happens and try and be here when they get hurt. But your, your kids are, your kids are small. So how do you, how are you navigating that with the world changing the way it is?

49:48 - Andrew (Guest)

Humbly Like it's so's yeah, it's so complex. You know, like, thinking about all I definitely I, my wife and I, are really lucky to have such a great teammate in this journey. We're sleep deprived but we definitely are trying our best to negotiate these waters in a way that's thoughtfully for our kids. But this interesting conversation we've had about social media, I'm now thinking about it in terms of, you know, my career, my own well, mental wellbeing of you know, scrolling, spending time on my phone, but then also like, what are we going to show our kids? You know, I'm like I'm.

50:35

My wife is so cool she's off it, she doesn't even do this stuff Cause she's like it's not part do this stuff because she's like it's not part. You know, she's like I, it's just not how I'm spending my time in my life, and so that's like a really not that we are some purists in any way, you know, with technology, but it's really cool because my, I love that about her, because I'm like my kids aren't seeing their mom glued to a device, whoa, yeah, and what's cool about that is that I think that might help them a little bit in their journey where, like, obviously, you know, for a few reasons, like I'm definitely on on some of that stuff a little bit more, particularly like when we're working yeah, it's part of work.

51:19

But I'm really lucky that, like, the kids aren't seeing that as just a normative behavior. Right, like, just wake up and be on your phone constantly, you know, and that's really cool. And I'm not saying that that's the right or wrong thing to do, it just happens to be what our reality is right now and I just appreciate it. But that said, like I we just took, like I've been driving with my kids forever and uh, we just one of our trips. We were borrowed a car, a family car that had flat screens on the back of the, uh the seats and, oh my god, like an eight-hour drive, blissful silence maybe you need that for the band right.

52:07

Exactly, I was like I need this on every vehicle we've ran from now on and then uh, and then, if you deprive your kids of it, just a little bit little parent hack for all you new parents and then you give you give them tv or an airplane or a car ride they are like it's like a, it's a very seminal experience for him. So they didn't even speak, it was, it was pretty. Uh, made the car ride go pretty, pretty quickly it's well, that's a great balance.

52:36 - Apple (Host)

That's a great balance, like, like what you're saying with you and your wife. That's a great balance for a kid to have dad's using it for work, mom's not using it at all, and then it's a treat when you go in the car like that.

52:48 - Aaron (Host)

Yeah, it's, it's hard, man, that it yeah, who knows the answer?

52:52 - Mel (Host)

it's so, there's no answer there really isn't, it's just what you're doing. Is is right, like I, I think when, especially when we're older, we forget that our parents didn't know how to be a parent they didn't know. They made it up. And now you're a parent and you're making it up. They don't know that either. They have no idea. So whatever you're doing is right. Whether later on in your life you can look back like, oh, we could have done that better, it's right right now.

53:23 - Aaron (Host)

I really thought when I was a kid, like for real.

53:27

For real thought that adults knew what was going on and what they were doing and like had a plan and like everything was cool and no man, it's not the. When you become an adult and you have kids of your own, you realize that your parents didn't know what the fuck was going on and they were winging it too. I there. The thing that made it come into like really sharp focus for me was actually when we lived moved here and a tree fell across the road at five o'clock in the morning and mel had to take an uber to work because she couldn't drive her car down. And then I was here at five o'clock in the morning and I was like when's the adult gonna come and get the tree out of the road? And I realized that that was me. I'm the adult that's standing out there at five o'clock in the morning. I don't know what the hell to do.

54:18 - Mel (Host)

So nobody knows what's going on, but figured it out, and that's what we do we figure it out, right.

54:23 - Dan (Guest)

That's adulting, that's adulting.

54:25 - Mel (Host)

Nobody wants to do that shit man.

54:27 - Apple (Host)

Well, that's the greatest thing we talked about. Your dad did the same thing, I think, when I was 55 now I think I was around 40 or so when my dad told me he was like son. Told me he was like son. If you haven't figured out by now, I don't know shit. I'm trying to figure it out, just like you do. I can give you guidance from what I've learned and stuff. But yeah, yeah, every day is figuring it out, and more so in the world we live in now with all the things, all the things coming at us in every direction.

54:55 - Aaron (Host)

I think in the world of all the things, one of the coolest parts of it is when you strip all that away and you get back to doing stuff like what these guys are doing yeah they got together as a band and created something from nothing yeah, that's, you guys put together an entire album from thoughts in your head. That is the gnarliest, coolest thing that you can do and it's healing and you're going out and you're healers.

55:25 - Apple (Host)

You're healing people, you're bringing community together.

55:27 - Aaron (Host)

There's nothing like dance and music putting, putting together the, the new album. What was the most fun part?

55:36 - Dan (Guest)

of it for you guys for each of you recording it in echo mountain, I would say, was the most fun, just being in the moment, you know, like still writing the song. Usually we, when we go into studio, we like beat the out of the songs and play them like 300 times and like, okay, we're on the clock, time is money, like you already know the song, just you know, play it. But this time around it was like we, oh, we're not really ready to do this, so it's just like what you're saying, like who's gonna come here and move this tree right? So, um, we put up like the whiteboard in the studio. We're writing the songs in the moment and I think it it's like, yeah, again we're talking about the collective consciousness.

56:20

This synergistic moment of creation happened on the record and I feel like it's this like current that runs through each of the songs, because it was like that moment that all those vibes in that building, in that place, right, yes, and then to turn the microphones on and, you know, get a real-time capture, that, um, it, that's. That was the most fun for me, oh, wow what about you, andrew?

56:45 - Andrew (Guest)

um, yeah, I, I would say yeah, having done so many like typical studio sessions where you're where the songs have been rehearsed over and over and the clock's on, you're kind of just watching. You know hundred dollar bills just float away as you sit there adjusting microphones, like it was really liberating to go in and just have a lot of trust, like I know I've jammed with these guys, not maybe not as like an official band member, but I've spent clocked in a lot of like hours, you know, hanging out and playing, like playing different shows and tons of sit-ins. And I just knew, like when I get with these guys, like even when I was in other bands, like I knew I could just play what I'm hearing and I would get full support. It would and it would just kind of it always created something that I thought was pretty magical, you know. So I was like it was, hence I would go, I would go out of my way to keep sitting in and playing with with um, with these guys, and so then, once we started writing these songs, I would, I would hear um, there's a lot of interplay on this record between me and the guitarist where, um, we're, we're.

57:58

I can't even tell when I listen sometimes who's playing what, and that's exactly what I feel when I'm playing. When we play on stage and we start sort of this weird conversation, you know where the guitar and the electric mandolin or the acoustic mandolin are sort of interweaving, and I just always sort of know I mean it doesn't always work out maybe the way I expected, but I always always sort of know I mean it doesn't always work out maybe the way I expected, but I always just sort of know we're going to, it's going to coalesce, maybe is the word or something and it's like always, there's just always like some beauty in it, you know.

58:33

And so having those experiences live made it so much easier to just sit in Echo Mountain and just take chances, like I would hear something that Mikey or Dan would play like, or the drummer is just amazing and plays a lot of like world music beats, and I could just pivot right away and not be like, oh I'm just, I just ruined the take, you know, because that's what would happen, like when I was doing like sessions in new york city, like if I took a big chance and I was like well, I hear the drummer playing calypso and I start playing something to support that. You just hear the engineer, possibly, or the engineer in my mind going no no, cut it

59:18

too much, like you don't need to, you don't need to do that, and I and so it was really it was awesome doing doing it was probably at times a little little scary too, which made it even more interesting because you just sort of like listen deeper. You know, like I was just listening with such intensity. It was like it's kind of exhausting because you're just like so aware, hyper aware, of what was going on. Um, I, definitely, when the session was over, I got like we had a little time left and so, uh, everyone's probably really tired and they're like, oh, just go in, and why don't you take a few like extra solo passes? And I just remember being able to be like I can really go through the gambit of emotion here, you know, like I can throw anything to the wall in this time and it's going to be encouraged, and like no one's going to be like I just wasted three hours, you know, on these solos and it was a pretty that.

01:00:14

That, to me, is the experience that I'll never like, I'll never forget. It was just kind of looking up into the booth and feeling the support as I went pretty, you know, pretty, pretty wild on this record and some and some of the, some of the solos and stuff in terms of, like you know, my electric mandolin playing and it was. It was really cool to have like the full team sort of behind it. Uh, yeah, it was, it was, it was awesome. I'm I'm really uh so excited to take this music up on the road and uh share this stuff that um the track luminous teacher that's I mean, can you guys talk about that one?

01:00:57 - Mel (Host)

because that's that's kind of a different vibe from the rest of the album and it's so, first of all, beautiful and like. It's very, it's very comforting and beautiful, but it's it. It has a whole different, you know, vibe. So can you talk about that and how that one is, you know came about, or how it's different, or what was inspired?

01:01:23 - Dan (Guest)

absolutely. Um, yeah, so I'm, I'm the singer, as I mentioned, and I'm I'm also, you know, because I'm the one singing it.

01:01:31

They're like you write the lyrics too, because you gotta sing you gotta sing so, um, yeah, I mean honestly for, as a quick aside, like for the songwriting process, like, um, I I'm hearing a lot of like melodies in my head and that's kind of where it starts, you know, like I hear the melody and then, like, as I'm going to sleep and I'll, like you know, do the whole thing right, pick up the iphone and like hum it into the phone and hopefully you can tell what it is in the morning. So that's all. A lot of the songs are written, um, and it specifically with luminous teacher. Um, you know, I don't mind sharing if with your audience that uh, um, I went to peru in uh spring of 2018 with my wife, uh, who does retreats in peru.

01:02:21

She's an herbalist here in Asheville, but we've been to Peru together three times and on the third time that we went, you know this is again 2018. We did the ayahuasca journey, which was very profound experience and I feel like it's it changed me to this day, um, and that song, uh, more or less came out of out of that experience. So that's pretty much what that song is about, like that day, what it was like for me and some of that vibe, for sure um we.

01:02:57 - Aaron (Host)

We had a gentleman on the show.

01:03:00 - Mel (Host)

Dr Jeff McNary Jeff.

01:03:01 - Aaron (Host)

McNary. He's part of this thing called Rhythmia in Costa Rica and it's like a five-star wellness ayahuasca retreat and I've never, like I've always said like I'm not going to go to the jungle and do that Like I can't, I just know I'm not gonna go to the jungle and do that, like I I can't, I just know I'm not doing it. And we had this guy on the show and and I had all these like preconceived notions of like you know, prejudgment of what a five-star ayahuasca retreat is. And we're like we have all these like questions for the guy that we're gonna like drill him when he gets on, like straight.

01:03:40 - Mel (Host)

we have all these like questions for the guy that we're going to like drill him when he gets on with it Like straight.

01:03:44 - Apple (Host)

We were kind of like skeptical, very skeptical.

01:03:46 - Mel (Host)

We were like no, you know, like we had all these, like, oh, it's probably so expensive, it's. What are they giving back to the community? All these kinds of like things that in our head we were thinking about and he came on and we never even got the chance to ask him the questions.

01:04:02 - Aaron (Host)

He answered all of it before we could even do it like he was just telling us all the stuff and at the end he was like and I want to invite you guys down, just get down here and and we'll take care of everything for you guys and I was like yeah, okay, you know, he said it on the show, whatever. And then like two days later he emailed and was like no, I really meant it and I want you guys to come down. So I never felt called to do that medicine.

01:04:34 - Apple (Host)

But I do now, you do now okay this is new to us, because I was just going to say, and on those notes, dan. I've been on the fence. Me and Mel have been wanting to book a date since he said it. It's been a month, month and a half or so, and Aaron's like, oh well, we'll see. And there he is. I was going to say Dan, convince him more.

01:04:51 - Mel (Host)

Well, this is the thing about with that whole thing is like, you know, we asked him like, is there any crazy things that you or things that have surprised you about working with ayahuasca? And he's like, yes, how the medicine starts to work on people once they decide that they're coming, before they're even there, before they board the plane, before they even get their ticket. But they decided they're doing it and the medicine starts working on them. And you know, for us, we're, you know we're no strangers to psychedelics or anything like that, but you know there's respect that you that's doing. You know, psychedelic versus doing a plant medicine in a ritual or a ceremonial space is a completely different animal. Yeah, that's a different, different animal, yeah, and so having that experience with him, where he was speaking to us without knowing our speculation or our our skepticism, skepticism.

01:05:48

Thank you, it was the medicine it was absolutely the medicine and and I believe that it was a medicine that had him invite us as well I really feel like that. Ever once he said that, I I felt it in my heart, you know and I've never.

01:06:01 - Apple (Host)

We haven't heard, I haven't heard anybody say like it was a horror. We've heard a lot of people, friends and band members. I've never heard anybody say that it was not a good experience and well, I think yeah I'm sorry, I don't mean to mention that.

01:06:18 - Dan (Guest)

I I think that you know, I would say to your listeners that it's not for everyone and that I do think it's important to go the path that you're saying well, I don't feel called, you got to listen to that. But when you do feel called and you make that decision yeah, that's super interesting about the second you decide to do it. It's like a non-linear phenomena. I would say you have to like, approach it like with reverence, right, and you have to like the wife and I did what they call the dieta, right. So you're eliminating all these. You know, no coffee, no alcohol, no weed, no sex, no spicy foods which was a crazy one. So you have to get rid of all that and kind of like fast the day up. And I think if you approach it like that, I mean I'll just say this and then I'll, you know, be done with it.

01:07:17

But you're having an encounter with an entity that is present and there's. It's similar in some ways to the psychedelics that we know here, like in all our culture, but like, like you said, mel, the uh intention and the ceremony and ritual rites. It's a. It's a very different experience. It's much more intense and I will say my experience was, uh, very cleansing and very therapeutic. I felt like and it was like some inner child stuff, oh wow. So I kind of came out of it feeling great for me personally.

01:08:02 - Mel (Host)

But I know this is the last part of it. I just wonder. You said that you're changed forever. How did it affect your music?

01:08:09 - Dan (Guest)

Yeah, well, that song came out of it. Yeah, there it is I mean it's amazing.

01:08:17 - Mel (Host)

We all once Apple was saying that you got to listen to this one, got to listen to this track. So I was like, going down the line, he's like no, I want you to listen to this one. I put it on and it felt like somewhere that's. That's what I can say about the music.

01:08:29 - Apple (Host)

It felt like somewhere the entire album is amazing, but that's like a departure from it. That one threw me off.

01:08:47 - Andrew (Guest)

I was listening to it in the car and I'm driving like the other stuff's more driving like me, than then that one hit and I'm like whoa well, but an LBL is awesome, is it LBL, right, is it?

01:08:51 - Mel (Host)

or LBL? Yeah, that one is, I wouldn't say similar vibe, but it kind of kind of kept that tone going. I just feel like the what an amazing way to end the album is really like what a great job. I love it. You guys are really doing a service to yourselves and to the listeners and I just want to thank you for that.

01:09:11 - Apple (Host)

I know I have one follow before we get ready to wrap up. This is a follow on those heels. This is a good segue to it. A follow-up question of mel's from five years ago for andrew she. She said when we found out then, uh, when found out you were expecting a child in a couple weeks, she goes. I'm very curious to know how it's going to change or affect your playing and your music once you have a child, because it affects everything in life. I'm just wondering how does that play with having children now? Has it affected your music?

01:09:44 - Andrew (Guest)

Oh yeah, I could talk about this all night. I think it's been pretty profound, because now it's so much harder to go away from my family than it's ever been before, as you guys all know. It's just, it's um. So when I do play, I feel like there's I really want to make the most of the moment because I know, like what the cost of what that is and how much I'm, you know, I'm missing them. So I feel like when I am playing, there's just more of like a weight to like. You know, I'm an instrumentalist. I can't. I wish I could sing, like Dan, you know. So I just play stringed instruments, but I just feel like my phrasing has become, has changed in a way of it's just more more like direct, like I just want to get these like succinct emotions out in a way that I, that I'm feeling and I've also like never like really experienced like love, you know, and like now my capacity for love is like this ocean now blown open.